Thursday, April 22, 2021
Stu Sutcliffe Part 2: The Interview
Tosh Berman: Stu, thank you for allowing me to interview you. I know you have little interest in talking about your past or art, and I’ll try to make it as painless as possible.
Stu Sutcliffe: Ha! That remains to be seen, Tosh.
T.B.: What drew you into the visual arts?
SS: Ah….I’m one of those people who think visually or musically. I’m not really good at music, but I can see music as a visual medium, and maybe that is why I do art. I like words, and I love the act of writing, but when I look at my notebook at the end of the day, it’s a visual thing more than a precise collection of letters to make words. I met my friend John, who I later did music with, because of how he mixed words with his drawings. I often felt Johnny’s natural talent is a cartoonist or artist. He had trouble focusing on paper, but in music, it’s obvious now that was the medium for him. Still, it’s interesting he got into more conceptual art with Ono.
TB: I was going to try to avoid that person in this interview (laughs). Did John had an influence on you with regard to painting?
SS: No. He liked me as much as I liked him, but I think he wasn’t that interested in my art. He wanted me in his band because he knew I would defend him against anyone else in the group. In case there was a coup of some sort (laughs). But I have to say I was very impressed with John’s ability to draw something amusing at a second’s notice. He was a man who had little patience to wait for something to inspire him. When he did something, he worked hard to obtain whatever he was looking for. He wasn’t the most social person on this planet, but you know, we got along very well. He certainly needed to be surrounded by people, but I’m happy to be in my studio and do work by myself.
TB: Were there any other artists that you admired at the time?
SS: When I was in Hamburg, I discovered this art group or movement called COBRA. One of the prominent artists in that group is Asgar Jorn, and he made a significant impression on me. I also liked Karel Appel. His work had a lot of humor, and I read he was inspired by Picasso as well as Jean Dubuffet. Playfulness is important to me. When I did my work in the early 60s, I was very serious. And hungry! I had two good friends who took care of me in those days, Klaus and Astrid. Without them … who knows what would have become of me!
TB: Do you think of yourself as an abstract painter?
SS: No. I think labels serve the viewer or reader more. I don’t even believe in such categories. It doesn’t offend or anger me, but as I mentioned, I think visually and not even what one calls pictorial images, but … I can start painting you, but it won’t be your face or body, but a picture in my head that makes me think of you. Sometimes it’s vacant, and I feel I have to put something there to make it real for me. Again, it’s hard for me to talk about it because it’s not a vocabulary thing but more of doing something and reacting to the most meaningful moment.
TB: You don’t travel much?
SS: No, only for the purpose of exhibits or maybe a vacation trip, but I prefer to stay in one location and just totally focus on working in my studio. I’m now back in Liverpool because of family issues, but also it’s very familiar to me. The same for Hamburg. Maybe because they’re both port towns. I like the feeling of things coming to me and not me going to them.
TB: When you left The Beatles, was it a big decision for you?
SS: Oh no, not at all. Probably the easiest decision I ever made. I didn’t want to work with others, except for or with Astrid, my girlfriend at the time. Looking back now, I think she was my most significant influence. Astrid was my entranceway to somewhere different, and it wasn’t a travel thing. She actually opened my head. We can be in one room together, but the walls keep moving back and back. It didn’t hold us in. I felt John was going somewhere where the wall was not going to move. I couldn’t imagine myself in that world. Man, that would have been poison for me.
TB: Was there any incident that made you feel that way?
SS: No, not really. (long silence). The other four were very much like a gang, and I was accepted to be part of that gang. Being in a group, you have to share with others to become whole - and I feel I’m whole with me in front of a canvas or paper. I didn’t want to become part of a group or someone’s band. John and I used to really get into drunken fights. That I enjoyed! Beyond that, I had very little interest in their music or fame. I like the idea that Klaus stuck around them and played music in London. Klaus can do both, but I’m a very focused type of guy, and I can’t have distractions.
TB: When the Beatles became massive…..
SS. Oh god, I had no idea that would happen. When Yoko came into his life or picture, I thought, yeah, this is a natural progression for him. I met Yoko a few times, and she strikes me as a powerful and confident person. She’s like Astrid in that manner. John needed someone stronger than him. Anyway, I kind of like it that we had distance. He sent postcards, and I send the exact postcard back to him with a drawing on top of his picture. That itself was the best conversation I had with him.
TB: You have stuck with drawing and paintings. Were you ever attracted to the idea of doing video or something in another medium?
SS: I see my paintings as movies or a journal entry. I can see a work of mine, and I know exactly what I was thinking while doing that work. I have sketchbook after sketchbook - some I made into books or limited edition things, but they were made just for my eyes alone. But I didn’t want to get too precious about the notebooks. Therefore, I now share them with the world or whatever is left of the world.
TB: Can I ask one more question?
SS.: You just did, so your questions are all up and now over.
Painting copyright 2019 Stuart Sutchliffe Estate